Skyrim talk:Leveled Items/Archive 1

This is an archive of past Skyrim talk:Leveled Items discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page, except for maintenance such as updating links.

All Items

Is this all the leveled items, pulled from the CK, or should we keep our eyes peeled for other likely candidates?-174.93.85.72

This is all of the obvious entries in the game data, i.e., all of the cases where the same name appears multiple times. There's a possibility there are others where the name is different at each level (comparable to Shivering:Amber_Weapons), so if you notice cases like that, post the item name here. Or else they'll be discovered once more people are able to look more closely at all the game data. --Nephele^Talk 08:20, 28 November 2011 (UTC)

Levels required for each version?

Could be good to include what each version corresponds to.

Is it a direct mapping to novice/apprentice/expert/master? I.e., do I need to be level 50 to get the best version of a sword? — Unsigned comment by 90.201.242.76 (talk) at 08:35 on 16 November 2011

what lvl do i need to be to get the best version? — Unsigned comment by The-commander (talk • contribs) at 05:08 on 24 November 2011

that's a good question, anyone with pc know? Qwertyone 00:33, 25 November 2011 (UTC)

Levels have been added to the page. --Nephele^Talk 08:20, 28 November 2011 (UTC)

About the Robes

The Robes are said to be leveled, but I see no difference in the leveled stats, all of the 4 versions of each robe have the exact same enchantments, what does this mean? — Unsigned comment by 83.163.94.153 (talk) at 03:20 on 20 November 2011

No idea yet. I'm just pulling out game data and dumping it onto wiki pages as fast as I can, and I haven't time to look into the details of the robes yet. --Nephele^Talk 08:20, 28 November 2011 (UTC)

About the nightingale armor

Since its possible to retrive that armor many times, maybe when you retrive it again at a higher level, the enchantments will be stronger. Anyone tried this? — Unsigned comment by 62.97.166.97 (talk) at 19:09 on 22 November 2011

I have some free time and can try, where do you get the armor? — Unsigned comment by Qwertyone (talk • contribs) at 00:32 on 25 November 2011

(←) Has anyone figured out if the higher leveled version of the Nightingale set can be obtained later, if the lower leveled versions are acquired earlier in the same playthrough? 166.182.3.132 03:51, 1 December 2011 (UTC)

Thus far, I have actually found no evidence that it does indeed allow you to replace the armor. All accounts I have read suggest it doesn't, and my personal experience reflects this. Under what conditions will the armor be replaced? What constitutes lost? Surely not out of inventory, that would allow duplication, and accounts of people who have sold the armor and waited for the shops to reset have not received a replacement. --97.81.109.45 00:24, 15 December 2011 (UTC)

okay on the chest plate it says "increases stamina by 40 points" but it dose not raise my carry weight by boosting it like in the other games. is this a bug or dose increasing your stamina with magic not affect your carry weight at all? no rush for an answer just curious. Froggy™ 06:31, 22 February 2012 (UTC)

Fortify Stamina only increases your Stamina; it never increases your Carry Weight in Skyrim, as stated on all the linked articles. --Nephele^Talk 06:41, 22 February 2012 (UTC)

Levels:

Did some console jumping around from a level 23 saved (CBF going through intro again for the lowest values) and got the following results for Chillrend (which has the most versions):

Character Level: Frost Damage 23 : 15 25 : 15 30 : 20 35 : 20 40 : 25 45 : 25 50 : 30

Don't think any other items on this list are checkable by console like this? coc RiftenMercerFreyHouse puts you right in front of Chillrend's case, but i tenetatively suspect all the top levelled items are at 50.

~Luagha — Unsigned comment by 121.44.193.223 (talk) at 07:06 on 28 November 2011

Levels have been added to the page, all taken directly from the game data. But it's reassuring to see that the game data levels match ones tested in game. --Nephele^Talk 08:20, 28 November 2011 (UTC)

Well, sort of. Looking at those numbers i didn't stop at every relevant break point (26/36/46). Thank you for fleshing it out properly. ^_^ ~Luagha. — Unsigned comment by 121.44.193.223 (talk) at 09:19 on 28 November 2011

Amulet of Articulation:

The item codes for the amulet of articulation don't line up with what is in the page. f6911 is an amulet better than those described, with 10 armor, and a 35% speechcraft bonus. 174.56.54.188 05:46, 29 November 2011 (UTC)

I've updated all of the amulet descriptions to provide the description given by the amulet, instead of the description given by the enchantment. So it now reads 35% speechcraft bonus. The original effect magnitude, 25 pts, is still correct, however. I have no idea of how to interpret the fact that two different magnitudes are given for each amulet.

As for the armor rating, the base armor rating is indeed 8 pts for f6911. It's possible the armor rating is modified by one of your armor skills and/or armor-related perks, just like the armor rating for helmets or gauntlets. In that case, however, I have no idea whether it's Light Armor or Heavy Armor that matters, because the ring is not tagged with either armor skill. --Nephele^Talk 21:25, 3 December 2011 (UTC)

Bugs

nightingale blade's top level version is bugged, you can't upgrade it. pls post this on bethesda forums for patch 88.132.143.118 23:11, 29 November 2011 (UTC)

Adding Placement

Maybe add the locations of the weapons. — Unsigned comment by 207.6.22.189 (talk) at 20:35 on 1 December 2011

Done. Stouf761 05:44, 31 December 2011 (UTC)

Correct Data?

Either I don't understand the tables, or the data is wrong, (probably former but): I just found the pale blade, unintentionally; (I was trying to reach lvl 46 before aquiring any levelled weapons). According to the table the pale blade will be maxed at lvl 27, I am lvl 35. However, the stats of my pale blade match those of the lvl 6-11 blade in the table (ignoring base damage as I have perks in 1hd). Both mine and the one in the table have weight 12 and frost damage 10. They both have a similar monetary value. Zuphix 00:05, 2 December 2011 (UTC)

The numbers come directly from the game data, and I just double-checked the leveled list, in particular to make sure that I hadn't overlooked any flags/settings that could alter how the list works.

Although the numbers may be correct, the biggest problem right now is that we don't know how the game uses the numbers. It seems very likely that Skyrim shifts/adjusts the leveled lists based on the difficulty of the dungeon. We've also been told that the level of a dungeon is fixed the first time you enter it. So if you're re-entering dungeons you first stepped into at level 10, it's possible the creatures and loot are all permanently fixed at level 10.

At the moment we really just need lots of information on what exactly happens when you're playing the game so that we can start to learn how the game works. --Nephele^Talk 20:51, 3 December 2011 (UTC)

I have a feeling that it is based on when you found the area, triggering Eisa Blackthorn fighting the bandits. I am level 67, but also got the lvl 6-11 version. I did the quest in concurrent with finding Kharjo's Moon Amulet, which I started near the beginning of the game, but held off doing until now. If I remember correctly, I found Frostmere Crypt when I was pretty low-leveled and I'm also definite that I never entered the cave before either.

Axe of Whiterun

The first time through, my axe was a steel axe with a Fear enchantment. The second time, it was an orcish axe with the same enchantment. Gideon Dragontongue 21:02, 5 December 2011 (UTC)

It (and all of the other thane rewards) aren't really leveled items. They're just items that have been randomly selected from the Generic Magic Weapons page and given a different name to make you think that they're somehow special. Their stats are no different than the generic weapons. --Nephele^Talk 21:23, 5 December 2011 (UTC)

Yeah, that's what I thought. I think I was reading Chillrend's stats by accident... Embarrassing! Gideon Dragontongue 15:44, 7 December 2011 (UTC)

(←) I have a axe bearing the name "Axe of Whiterun". The page says there is no item bearing that name. (Eddie The Head 03:26, 21 December 2011 (UTC))

It's not a leveled item but a randomly-selected generic magic weapon with a fancy name. --Nephele^Talk 21:53, 26 December 2011 (UTC)

It's not completely random. I, too, received a steel axe with a fear enchantment. Additionally, I reloaded my save several times right before receiving the Blade of Winterhold and it was an ebony sword with drain magic every single time. I'm pretty sure it depends on who is Jarl, and it may also depend on level. Regardless, the weapons aren't anything to write home about so it's not especially important. Additionally, if you wish, you can create a new weapon and give it the appropriate name, and for all purposes within the game's code it's the same weapon (aside from perhaps enchantment magnitude). --Theothersteve7 21:36, 23 February 2012 (UTC)

I don't understand Nephele's comment above. The Axe of Whiterun does not seem to be listed/pictured anywhere on the wiki, except on the Dragon's Rising quest page. Where does it go? --JR (talk) 02:28, 7 March 2013 (GMT)

Searching for any of the weapons rewarded when granted Thaneship redirects to the leveled lists page, hich has little to do with actual items. A redirect to the Generic Magic Weapons page as well as a note there might be more accurate. Elakyn (talk) 06:25, 7 March 2013 (GMT)

Links to quests

Where applicable, each levelled item should note what quest must be undertaken to obtain it, and exactly what part of the quest where its level is decided. Anyone agree? 166.182.3.135 17:28, 6 December 2011 (UTC)

I'll second that. Gideon Dragontongue 16:17, 8 December 2011 (UTC)

I added some info. It would be too much of a spoiler to say exactly what part you get the items at. Stouf761 05:47, 31 December 2011 (UTC)

the axe of whiterun is random. the game has a memory and knows when it is being reloaded

Nightingale Armor Smithed to Epic

I have the mid-range Nightingale Armor (received it when I was level 30), and I was able to smith all of the pieces to *epic* level, which I believe is higher than *flawless*. Correct me if I am wrong. I can provide screenshots too if needed.

Armor: rating 213, value 2303 Boots: rating 78, value 453 Gloves: rating 78, value 1212 Hood: rating 99, value 1277

(99.136.224.214 22:20, 9 December 2011 (UTC))

Nightingale Armor Enchantments

Are these still correct? I consoled myself from 29 to 50 and noticed no change to their values. The enchantment only reached the second enhancement (Ei 20% on the gloves, 15% on the hood etc) — Unsigned comment by 70.29.64.5 (talk) at 22:00 on 13 December 2011

seem there's a bug here. I'm lvl 32 and armor still in 30% 30%, i consoled myself until 42 without any change. However the other pieces (head, gloves, boots) have the right value at lvl 32 — Unsigned comment by 88.187.24.95 (talk) at 16:47 on 25 December 2011

Please try reading the article:

The item is scaled in power based on the player's level at the time the reward is given.... The items do not improve in quality when your character levels up.

--Nephele^Talk 17:46, 25 December 2011 (UTC)

Well can you somehow replace your armor to get the better set?

Nightingale Blade

Is it possible to obtain multiple blades on the console versions of the game? — Unsigned comment by 77.106.180.38 (talk) at 12:48 on 15 December 2011

No. Or yes. I'm not sure. I heard that by putting an item into a chest outside dawnstar, you can buy it off the khajit shopkeeper and also recover the ne in the chest. gonna see if its true. — Unsigned comment by 219.88.64.227 (talk) at 09:39 on 21 December 2011

Apparently the highest leveled version of this blade is not able to be tempered with at a grindstone even with the arcane blacksmith perk, Although lower leveled versions of the blade are. Anybody have an idea why this is? — Unsigned comment by 71.108.42.42 (talk) at 23:00 on 11 February 2012

It's a bug. They redundantly let you upgrade the second-highest version instead of the highest. – Robin Hood↝talk 08:08, 4 March 2012 (UTC)

What exactly does it mean for this blade to have damage per second? I hit someone once and their health drains until they die? King Mango

The "per second" type of damage always has a limit of x number of seconds to it. In this case, it's only one second, so each time you hit someone (assuming the blade has charges), their health will be decreased over the course of one second rather than instantly. Per second attacks are often used in conjunction with some other attack, or fighting while backing away from your attacker, in order to give them time to have their full effect without wasting charges. – Robin Hood↝talk 19:07, 11 March 2012 (UTC)

Dragonbane

re the VN on the article page for the level 46+ version, I have the 36-45 one but that too is clearly not even remotely close to 230 uses: it's half empty now after about 40, maybe 50 at the most. Given the impact of Destruction skill and perks on weapon uses, 230 likely requires 100 Destruction, and possibly whatever the half-cost perk for the weapon's enchantment level is. Aliana 09:55, 16 December 2011 (UTC)

Gaulder Black-weapons

The levels for these weapons don't agree with what just dropped for me at level 73 when entering both tombs for the first time.

The bow was a 15 point absorb magic effect and the sword was a 10 point absorb health effect. Maybe these are also random stats regardless of your level like the Amulet of Articulation from the Thieves guild. — Unsigned comment by The Source (talk • contribs) at 21:29 on 18 December 2011

Notes moved from main page:

Gauldur Blackblade:

Note: This needs verification. I got the "Absorb 15 points of health:" version, while being level 41. Could not reload to get it again because my last save (I only use Autosaves) was after this.

Gauldur Blackbow:

Note: This needs verification too. I got the "Absorb 20 points of magicka:" version, while being level 42.

Gained at level 30 and also got Absorb 20 points of magicka version.

Personal experiences don't belong on the main article, but instead should be added here, on the talk page.

As for what's going on, I've double checked the game data and the leveled list info is correct. The levels are correct, the flags are set correctly, etc. My first guess is that the discrepancies have to do with how leveled lists work in Skyrim -- that the game scales lists according to the difficulty of the dungeon you're in. In which case, any issue applies to every item in the game. --Nephele^Talk 22:04, 26 December 2011 (UTC)

My bow has absorb 15p magicka, I was 72 when I got it.--84.248.192.31 10:47, 15 January 2012 (UTC)

I'm beginning to suspect that the Black-weapons are locked to your level once you pick up the related quest. I specifically waited until I was level 36 before entering Folgunthur and what I got was the 10-point Blackblade. I checked Mikrul with getlevel, and he was level 15, which more or less corresponds to what I was at when I picked up the quest by reading Lost Legends. --212.92.21.16 12:55, 25 January 2012 (UTC)

I started the Forbidden Legend quest at a high level, but got the low level items instead. It seems to be bugged. Lobsel Vith 12:50, 10 May 2012 (UTC)

I've been running a bunch of tests and it looks like the sword level is set as soon as you join the College of Winterhold and uses the +46 table not the +36 table. I'm almost done and when I have the tables filled out (hopefully before January 01 2015) will post the results with tables on the Swords talk page. Philbert (talk) 13:34, 8 December 2014 (GMT)

Chillrend

Seems Augment Frost (increase frost damage by 25%/50%) perk of destruction do effect the item's enchantment. My lv55 mage just got it with 45 frost damage on it... — Unsigned comment by Templarphoenix (talk • contribs) at 06:42 on 27 December 2011 It may be affected by your skill in enchanting

Upgrade those items later

Does anyone know a way to get the best version of a item once our character is lvl>50? For example I get the nightingale bow a long time ago but its stats are bad compare to my actual bow. If a knew it, I get it at a good level... — Unsigned comment by 2.6.128.60 (talk) at 19:46 on 8 January 2012

no there is no way of upgrading it to the default for a higher level. This is exactly the same for Oblivion. The only thing you can do is try to ugrade it a little more through smithing, if it is still too weak, then there is nothing you can do anymore. --Zach9054 20:45, 8 January 2012 (UTC)

Actually this is possible by using the player.additem command with the correct id. (PC version obviously). — Unsigned comment by 2.6.128.60 (talk) at 20:59 on 8 January 2012

Weapon Enchant Uses

Please do not edit the main article with the number of uses the weapon has for you. This is irrelevant because number of uses is affected by things such as your character's level and buffs to that spells school of magic. As an example it is possible for Nightingale Blade to have infinite charges for you if you have -100% casting cost for Destruction.

Each weapon has a total charge on it and the spell that weapon casts on hit has a base cost. That is what the numbers in the article are and should be derived from. Rookwood 19:33, 9 January 2012 (UTC)

Item Upgraded Itself (PS3)

I was awarded the Mage's Circlet at level 7, its enchant strength at 30pts. A few in-game weeks later I return to my home in Breezehome to find it has upgraded itself to 70pts... me now being level 51.

This is on the PS3

So I think it's possible that items might gain power upon levelling up........ but the trigger I have not determined. --139.153.52.23 09:08, 13 January 2012 (UTC)

Mage's Circlet Armor Rating

The Mage's Circlet (000f1b2e) shows an armor rating of 0 ingame, and the armor rating shown for the player does not change when equipping it. Like with clothing the odd value showing up in the game data seems to be ignored here. --Alfwyn 16:36, 27 January 2012 (UTC)

Nightingale Set level bug?

I understand that the set is leveled, I got the quest to meet Karliah in that stone but decided to go back it to later and come back in a higher level so I can recieve the best stats available for the set. I am now level 33 and I went back to meet Karliah go through the cave and once I get the armour set I still get the stats for 19-31 instead of 32+. Is this a bug?

Playing on the Xbox 360 — Unsigned comment by Gaetano (talk • contribs) on 28 January 2012

Before the release, there was some talk about dungeons locking to the level you had the first time you entered it. This may be such a case. --Alfwyn 12:33, 28 January 2012 (UTC)

You may be right, except that I did not enter the dungeon nor spoke to Karliah yet when I was a lower level, and came back at a higher level and spoke to Karliah. Perhaps the item stats got saved/locked when I started the quest Trinity Restored? --Gaetano 16:19, 28 January 2012 (UTC)

Shield of Solitude

It would probably be a good idea to note whether the Shield of Solitude is Light or Heavy armor. I don't have a save that can get through the quest, so I can't put it myself, but it would be a good idea to have it down. We should probably also put in a note on the Nightingale Armor, as well, just for the sake of consistency. Swk3000 15:21, 17 February 2012 (UTC)

The shield is Heavy Armor according to game data (found at list MS06Shield). --Alfwyn 15:52, 17 February 2012 (UTC)

Daedric artifacts

There is at least one daedric award that is leveled too. It's Dawnbreaker. I don't know if there are more of them. Maybe some information about it should be added to this page since there are no any notes on Skyrim:Daedric Quests or Skyrim:Dawnbreaker pages.

None of the Daedric artifacts are leveled items and therefore none of them belong on this article. There is a separate article dedicated to Artifacts, which has a link in the very first sentence of the Daedric Quests article. --Nephele^Talk 14:13, 21 March 2012 (UTC)

wabbajack

If wabbajack can reset leveled npc, can it reset leveled item if we give the item to the npc and wabbajeck him?(Vvardfell 13:02, 22 March 2012 (UTC))

No, only the NPC will level. The item will remain unchanged. Confirmed on both PC and PS3.--YetiWithFlamethrower 13:10, 19 April 2012 (UTC)

Dragonbane is missing in the new version

Forgotten, or has something changed ingame? http://uesp.net/wiki/Skyrim:Dragonbane — Unsigned comment by 62.75.138.253 (talk) at 12:57 on 19 April 2012

Good spot. Readded info. The Silencer has spoken^Talk 20:47, 19 April 2012 (UTC)

page upgrade???

whats with the "update" that strips out all but the max level of the item from the page? why dump 4/5ths of the info that was here? — Unsigned comment by 24.38.223.147 (talk) at 06:39 on 22 April 2012

That info is now found on the pages of the artifacts. (Eddie The Head 07:14, 22 April 2012 (UTC))

Chillrend Case is empty

Came there as 47lvl, finished Dark Brotherhood and College. Case is empty... wat the heck? Reloaded several times before entering Frey's house... mno effect at all always empty case. — Unsigned comment by 2.94.167.213 (talk) at 13:40 on 28 July 2012

It might have fallen through the floor.If you are on the PC you could use the console command tcl to look under the floor.And if you still can't find it you could use the additem command.I hope this helps!--Skyrimplayer 14:24, 28 July 2012 (UTC)

Miraak's Mask

Miraak's Mask needs to be added to the article. Not sure if there was a reason it hasn't been already so just mentioning it here.-- Valadez   Talk  Contributions  19:35, 5 January 2013 (GMT)

I imagine there is a location somewhere in the Dragonborn namespace where that could be placed, if it hasn't already. The Skyrim namespace is for the base game, Dawnguard, and Hearthfire. For organizational purposes, since Dragonborn adds such a crazy amount of content, we've split all of its content from the main namespace. All content related to Dragonborn goes there. Snowmane^{(talk•email)} 19:41, 5 January 2013 (GMT)

If it was to be included in Skyrim namespace it go on the artifacts page with the other masks, otherwise it be on a Dragonborn:Artifacts page. Silence is Golden^{Break the Silence} 19:58, 5 January 2013 (GMT)

Ah, makes sense. Now that you mention it I do remember the Shivering Isles leveled items being separate from Oblivions. Thanks. -- Valadez   Talk  Contributions  20:02, 5 January 2013 (GMT)

Dragonbane's an artifact

The description for Dragonbane is wrong. While it's a leveled item, it also fits the definition this wiki uses for Artifacts. It is *NOT* "indistinguishable from the average katana". It has a unique lightning effect on the blade. That ought to be taken out of this, and the sword added to the Artifacts page. — Unsigned comment by 66.30.21.53 (talk) at 02:45 on 22 August 2013 (GMT)

That is not a unique trait, that is due to it being an enchanted item. And even if it were an artifact, which I do not believe it meets the criteria for, it wouldn't be removed from this page as it is still a leveled item. --AKB ^{Talk Cont Mail} 02:44, 22 August 2013 (GMT)

Note: Although the lightning effect on the blade is unique, I believe, I do not think that's enough to qualify for artifact status. It's the same weapon, still. However, I guess it may be more worthy for debate than originally thought. Anyone else have anything to add? --AKB ^{Talk Cont Mail} 02:48, 22 August 2013 (GMT)

I'm not asking for it to be removed, just that bit of text changed, and then the weapon *added* to Artifacts.

If Chillrend is an artifact for being slightly bluer,then a katana with a totally unique visual effect (along the lines of Dawnbreaker), AND a totally unique enchantment, most certainly qualifies.

Harkon's Sword is on Artifacts. 'nuff said, I think. — Unsigned comment by 66.30.21.53 (talk) at 03:02 on 22 August 2013 (GMT)

I'm sorry for stating that you said it should be removed from the page, your original message was a bit unclear, but I understand what you were saying now. Chillrend is an artifact because it has an entirely unique texture, this weapon does not. Harkon's Sword is similar, as it has a unique texture as well. It has a unique effect, which might make it qualify, I would like to hear what others think first. That's the issue here, it's never been discussed if unique effect could qualify as unique appearance. I'm open to the change being made, but I want more opinions first. --AKB ^{Talk Cont Mail} 03:02, 22 August 2013 (GMT)

I don't think it fits. The lightning effect is not the blade being unique, it's just part of the enchantment. When that runs out, the blade is the same as any Blades Sword. Because it lacks any special appearance texture wise, unique to it. It is not an artifact anymore than Horksbane.--Br3admax (talk) 03:13, 22 August 2013 (GMT)

But you can enchant Horksbane. Dragonbane has the two enchantments. How is an effect not 'appearance'? How does only texture count? Say you had a sword with the same texture as the steel sword, but (oh, idk) say flames shot out of it with little skulls swirling about. Now say there's only one, a unique name, and it has two or three enchantments at least one of which is not on any other weapon. Would that not be an artifact, according to the given criteria?

It just seems awfully arbitrary to redefine the word 'appearance' to not mean 'what something looks like'.

To connect it to the onversation I'm having on the Artifacts page, the Rune Axe and Hammer don't have unique textures, but are on there. — Unsigned comment by 66.30.21.53 (talk) at 04:01 on 22 August 2013

(←) As I have hopefully established on that talk page, the circumstances for the inclusion of the Rune Axe and Hammer are different. I do not think your arguing is going to bring any other people around at this point, let us just wait for additional comments, as you have already made your opinion on this subject absolutely clear. --AKB ^{Talk Cont Mail} 04:18, 22 August 2013 (GMT)

Lunar Steel Weapons

Every Lunar Steel weapon includes the following text:

"Tempering the Lunar Steel [weapon] requires one steel ingot and the Arcane Blacksmith perk."

The Steel Smithing perk is a prerequisite for the Arcane Blacksmith perk. You either have both or neither. So the tempering is "twice as effective" as... what, exactly?

I'm inclined to replace this in all three with:

"Tempering the Lunar Steel [weapon] requires one steel ingot and the Arcane Blacksmith perk."

However, I would be surprised if there had not been some discussion around this before, so I thought I'd ask if there were some reason to explain it this way. It might be a very good reason.

Cdarklock (talk) 08:34, 13 March 2014 (GMT)

Forgive me if I'm missing something, but your proposed wording and the existing wording look identical to me. Are you proposing removing the subsequent "twice as effective" wording, since you can't temper it without the Arcane Blacksmith perk, which you can't take unless you have already taken the Steel Smithing perk? If so, then this seems reasonable to me. --Xyzzy ^Talk 13:41, 13 March 2014 (GMT)

I'm unsure what happened there, probably a copy/paste issue, but the existing wording on the page is (in every case) "Tempering the Lunar Steel [weapon] requires one steel ingot and the Arcane Blacksmith perk, with the tempering being twice as effective if the player has gained the Steel Smithing perk." (emphasis mine) It's that last bit that confuses me. Why is it there? Cdarklock (talk) 11:12, 6 April 2014 (GMT)

I seem to recall a similar conversation in the past, but it must have been on a different page. Maybe it was for some item with a similar scenario: an enchanted item with the WeapMaterialSteel keyword. I believe it's there because that's sort of the "default" wording for tempering magical items made of a material other than iron. I support its removal, since you can't temper these items without both perks, making the either/or comparison irrelevant. --Xyzzy ^Talk 15:29, 6 April 2014 (GMT)

Deletion Proposal & Strategy

This page is redundant with all of the other pages that discuss items in the Skyrim namespace, and doesn't provide any meaningful information on its own. I do, however, think having a list of leveled items in Skyrim is useful, but that is exactly why Category:Skyrim-Items-Leveled_Items exists. Thus, there is no purpose for this page. My proposal is as follows, and I plan to do all of the work for it myself assuming there are no major objections to this proposal.

• Go through all of what links here and make sure they are resolved before deleting this page
• Ensure that all items captures on this page are captured where they belong based on item criteria (Skyrim:Artifacts, Skyrim:Unique Items, etc.)
• Refactor notes about leveled lists to the appropriate pages where the items on this page will reside
  • These notes will point to the item's individual page, which details the specifics of its leveled list
• Put this page up for admin deletion

If anyone has any major objections to this, please voice them here and I will answer as I can. Thanks! ∬(RisingDusk)dxdy 14:28, 29 July 2014 (GMT)

I am against deletion because Category pages are meant to be just that, categories, not places that provide information like this page does. I could voice more, but I don't have the time to and I'm sure someone else will have more specific information on why this shouldn't be deleted. •WoahBro^►talk 15:01, 29 July 2014 (GMT)

What information do you feel is provided here that isn't provided anywhere else, and why should that information be kept here instead of on other pages where it is already captured and/or could be added? ∬(RisingDusk)dxdy 15:06, 29 July 2014 (GMT)

(edit conflict) WoahBro, I don't think the idea is to use the category as a replacement for this page. Looking at the current content, there doesn't seem to be anything here that isn't already (or couldn't be) covered on Artifacts, Unique Items, or other similar pages. The content here honestly seems redundant and a little arbitrary to me. ⇠eshe^talk 15:08, 29 July 2014 (GMT)

Yes. With the separate articles for unique items project nearing completion, it'll be simple to just transclude everything on this page that isn't an artifact into the new unique items page. There's really no reason to have this page anymore. --AN|L (talk) 15:26, 29 July 2014 (GMT)

I put myself in the shoes of a new user looking for a page to see what items are leveled, as they may wish to delay getting them until they are at a higher level. This page serves that purpose well. And its really the only purpose it serves. For that reason alone, I think it may be useful. The category page would do the job, but its not very user friendly, and casual wiki browsers probably don't know it even exists. Regarding the other item pages - they have their scope (unique, artifacts etc). This page has a different scope - despite the repeating info. --Jimeee (talk) 15:52, 29 July 2014 (GMT)

I considered that, Jimeee, but we have these pages: Skyrim:Leveled_Item_Quests / Skyrim:Quest_Timing. My plan here was to move the Leveled Item Quests page into the Quest Timing page, since that makes more sense to me and quest timing is exactly the sort of thing that users would look for in this regard. That way this information would still be captured for new users looking for what you're talking about. (Ideally I will also take that opportunity to improve the Quest Timing page to be better organized into tables) ∬(RisingDusk)dxdy 16:18, 29 July 2014 (GMT)

(←) It's been roughly a week since the last comment, and I wanted to ensure that this got sufficient visibility from interested parties before I went ahead and started implementing the changes described above. If you feel strongly about this or have a very good reason why this should/shouldn't be done that hasn't yet been expressed, please speak up! Also, if you've already posted but have changed your mind or have more to add, I encourage you to do so! Thanks. ∬(RisingDusk)dxdy 18:52, 4 August 2014 (GMT)

By my count, the current vote is 3 in favor of deletion/some other action and 2 against. Because there's no clear consensus as of yet, I would request that you refrain from taking any action on the matter until a consensus is reached. This isn't a formal deletion review, so we don't need to give it a single week to discuss. Zul se onikaan^{Laan tinvaak} 12:56, 5 August 2014 (GMT)

True, there were some concerns raised, but I think RisingDusk's plan addressed them. If the people who had concerns disagree or have more to add, now is the time to do it. There's not an established amount of time for allotted for this kind of thing, no, but there's also no point letting it sit open for much longer if there's no more input. :) ⇠eshe^talk 15:11, 5 August 2014 (GMT)

Unless we're redefining the other pages this page serves a purpose in capturing items that are leveled and not unique. It could probably be reduced to a table showing the item, where/when it is obtained (or the item level is set in some cases), and what level you need to get the maximum. Leveled Item Quests is less useful because some items are found outside quests, and it should not be incorporated into the Quest Timing page for that reason too. Silence is Golden^{Break the Silence} 17:48, 5 August 2014 (GMT)

Every single leveled item in Skyrim meets the requirements of being a unique item or artifact.
As for your other point, all leveled items in Skyrim are either found during a quest or are obtained as a reward for a quest with the exception of Tsun's Battleaxe (Which is completely unplayable / unobtainable anyway and thus belongs on Skyrim:Unobtainable Items) and the Lunar Weapons (Which, as noted before, count as Unique items). Those items associated with a quest would be noted in Quest Timing (Leveled Item Quests will become obsolete and either become a redirect or get deleted itself). Hopefully this ameliorates your concerns. ∬(RisingDusk)dxdy 19:25, 5 August 2014 (GMT)

Chillrend, the first item on the list, can be obtained without the mission being active. Silence is Golden^{Break the Silence} 19:41, 5 August 2014 (GMT)

Regardless of that, this page is a far better place for documenting the leveled items than an page dealing with quests. A table with all leveled items belongs here, and categories are not a suitable replacement, its a copout used by other wikis to save having to do any work. Silence is Golden^{Break the Silence} 19:51, 5 August 2014 (GMT)

First, to your note about Chillrend: I would still want it in quest timing because if a reader reaches Skyrim:The Pursuit, they would trigger its leveled list item selection and would want to know.
As for your other point, it is most certainly not a cop-out of any sort, and whether it is or isn't used by other wikis is irrelevant as a reason to not do it if it is the superior course of action. Categories are not being treated as a replacement, they were simply mentioned as a place where a user could obtain a list if so desired as all leveled items in Skyrim have their own pages and point to that category. If we want a small table of leveled items available in Skyrim, then as part of this rework I could add it to Skyrim:Leveled_Lists, but all of them bar the Lunar Weapons would be already captured in Quest Timing.∬(RisingDusk)dxdy 20:08, 5 August 2014 (GMT)

We use categories quite frequently as a way to collect lists containing information that some users might want, but that doesn't quite merit its own page (usually because the information would be redundant, which is something we prefer to avoid). See for example Category:Skyrim-Places-Bandit Camps, Category:Skyrim-Places-Animal_Dens, Category:Skyrim-Coded Documents, etc. In these cases, as I think would be appropriate in the case of Skyrim leveled items, the category just serves as a way of organizing information that's already presented elsewhere. I agree that the items on this page really could be better documented on other pages, leaving the category just in case anyone happens to be looking for the items that are leveled. We have enough redundancy in the items pages as it is, and I think this is a good way to start addressing that. ⇠eshe^talk 20:21, 5 August 2014 (GMT)

Leveled Lists is for lists produced by the game, and is even less appropriate as an alternative page. The reason categories do not work is that they do not give detailed information on the item, such as the max level or the quest needed, they contain only a name. This page should resemble the Oblivion:Leveled Item Quests page, but cannot be named the same because there are non-quest leveled items. There is a degree of redundancy in having both this page and the quest timing page, but the differing perspectives are more than enough to dismiss those concerns. Making people trawl through all the detail on the quest timing page to find an item they desire so they can see when it is maxed out, when this page makes so much more sense in that regard is not a better option. Those categories mightn't have specific pages, but they are adapted and used in places like Skyrim:Amulet_of_the_Moon#Find_the_Amulet. Silence is Golden^{Break the Silence} 20:34, 5 August 2014 (GMT)

(←) I am currently in the process of enacting the less impacting components of these changes. I will continue to watch this page for further discussion, however. ∬(RisingDusk)dxdy 15:13, 11 August 2014 (GMT)

I am giving this the hardest no I can. This page should not be deleted. --AKB ^{Talk Cont Mail} 15:15, 11 August 2014 (GMT)

There has been a discussion about this. You can't just undo edits because you disagree with them personally. If you feel like my changes are unreasonable, then discuss them here with more words than you have, and we can talk through it like good wiki editors do. ∬(RisingDusk)dxdy 18:43, 11 August 2014 (GMT)

DLC

This hasn't appeared to have been updated in a while...

There where new leveled items added in the Dlc's. Is it possible these could be added?— Unsigned comment by 71.217.68.188 (talk) at 12:24 on 09 August 2014

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